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Absit Omen

by: Maryscott O'Connor

Tue Sep 09, 2008 at 13:46:08 PM PDT







"I have a dream that my four little children
will one day live in a nation where they
will not be judged by the color of their skin
but by the content of their character."





This election marks a potential turning point in American history. The American people will either elect the first black President, following the dictates of logic, self-interest and absolute common sense... or they will elect John McCain and prove that at least a slim majority of the voters in this nation are ignorant fools, religious extremists, blind believers of the partisan propaganda of the right wing, outright racists -- or some horrifying combination of those descriptors.

Maryscott O'Connor :: Absit Omen






If you hear the dogs, keep going.
If you see the torches in the woods, keep going.
If they're shouting after you, keep going.
Don't ever stop. Keep going.
If you want a taste of freedom, keep going.

They're out there. We know they're out there. And they will vote against Obama because he is a black man. Period. Some of them -- probably many more than we'd like to believe -- are registered Democrats. Such is the reality of racism in America in 2008.

This much is true: Many millions of people will vote on the issues and many millions will vote reflexively based on other factors like how they always vote, what propaganda they believe, which "personalities" they prefer and so on. This much is also true: Many millions of people will vote for or against Barack Obama because he is a black man.

Make no mistake: The single determinative factor in this election is the colour of Barack Obama's skin. And there is nothing we can do about the people who will vote against him because of it, just as there is nothing the other side can do about the people who will vote for him because of it.

There are still many, many votes to be won on the issues; the Obama campaign knows this as surely as they know the Republican Fraud Machine didn't shut down in 2004. They're doing their job and, insofar as I can see, they're doing it well, given the huge -- albeit predictable -- disadvantage the Democrat always faces in a hostile and Republican-owned media.

The question remains, then, for those of us sitting on the sidelines, subject to hourly mood swings based on polls and biased media coverage and the myriad other depressingly familiar and predictable factors we understandably experience as harbingers of doom in modern Presidential politics: What are we supposed to do about all this?

I could tell you to ignore the polls and the media, but that would be silly; you're political junkies just like I am -- telling you to ignore it all would be like telling a heroin addict to ignore the baggie of China White on his kitchen counter every day for the next two months.

We have options. First, and most important: If you really, truly care about the outcome of this election, then get off your ass and DO SOMETHING. Register voters, is my first suggestion. It's the single most important factor in this race, next to... race. Nearly 8 million African Americans -- eligible to vote -- are not registered to vote:


Nearly one in three African Americans have yet to get registered

While Sen. Barack Obama's historic campaign has injected a powerful dose of enthusiasm into America - particularly Black America - there are still 8 million African Americans that have not yet been moved to register.

Rick Wade, who handles African-American voter outreach for the Obama campaign says that some 32 percent of the Black voting-age population is currently out of the loop. "Our principal focus has been a 50-state voter registration initiative," Wade told NNPA. "I think we all appreciate that if we increase the number of African American registered voters and then increase turnout and get people to the polls on Nov. 4, then Sen. Obama will be the next president of the United States."

Four years ago, more than one in 10 voters was Black, he said. "If the percentage of African Americans was a mere two-and-a-half percent higher, 13.5 percent, Democrats would currently be running for re-election at this time," he said. "For example in the state of Ohio in 2004, we lost by two percent or 100,000 votes. There were 270,000 unregistered African Americans. I use that as an illustration to show how the African American vote can make the difference in a state and across this country. So the African American vote can absolutely make the difference in this election."

You bet your ASS this race is going to be about race. You don't think the racists out there are voting based on race? Well, FUCK THEM. We've got the issues voters. We've got the intelligent voters. That still leaves us having to make up the deficit made by the racists and the fools. Get out there and register voters.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

I want to say something now to those of you who seem to honestly believe there is little to no difference between Barack Obama and John McCain -- that the differences are essentially cosmetic (pardon the expression) and that we're dealing with Tweedledee and Tweedledum again. Now, I don't agree. I just don't; but that is an argument we can have another day. Surely we can agree on this: if for NO OTHER REASON, can we not agree that the election of Barack Obama to the Presidency is preferable to that of John McCain because of its historical significance and the defeat of the forces of racism -- of ignorance, hatred and sheer fucking EVIL -- amassing against it?

If you believe that there is NO DIFFERENCE between Obama and McCain and you consider yourself a leftist or a liberal, then are you not ALL THE MORE interested in seeing Obama elected on this point alone? There is no other viable candidate, my friends. Your pleas for Cynthia McKinney or Nader fall on deaf ears this year of all years: We have the opportunity to break completely new ground with this election, regardless of how you perceive these candidates' positions on the issues.

Yes, I just said that: If you think it doesn't matter which of these men is elected, then work your ass off for Obama BECAUSE HE IS A BLACK MAN and THAT IS ENOUGH OF A REASON.

Like I said: I do not believe for a second that's the only reason to elect Obama. But if you NEED a reason to stop bitching and moaning and spreading your negativity around like so much stinking fucking manure -- I just gave it to you. Don't call yourself a liberal in my presence and tell me it isn't a damned good fucking reason, or I will have to seriously question whether you ever took a history class, let alone have been paying attention during your lifetime to the realities of racism in this country.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

You have choices. You can watch the polls as they come in on an almost-hourly basis and bemoan the state of things as they are -- or you can get up and TRY LIKE HELL TO CHANGE THINGS.


"This country of ours has more wealth than any nation, but that's not what makes us rich. We have the most powerful military on Earth, but that's not what makes us strong. Our universities and our culture are the envy of the world, but that's not what keeps the world coming to our shores.

Instead, it is that American spirit - that American promise - that pushes us forward even when the path is uncertain; that binds us together in spite of our differences; that makes us fix our eye not on what is seen, but what is unseen, that better place around the bend.

That promise is our greatest inheritance. It's a promise I make to my daughters when I tuck them in at night, and a promise that you make to yours - a promise that has led immigrants to cross oceans and pioneers to travel west; a promise that led workers to picket lines, and women to reach for the ballot.

And it is that promise that forty five years ago today, brought Americans from every corner of this land to stand together on a Mall in Washington, before Lincoln's Memorial, and hear a young preacher from Georgia speak of his dream.

The men and women who gathered there could've heard many things. They could've heard words of anger and discord. They could've been told to succumb to the fear and frustration of so many dreams deferred.

But what the people heard instead - people of every creed and color, from every walk of life - is that in America, our destiny is inextricably linked. That together, our dreams can be one.

'We cannot walk alone,' the preacher cried. 'And as we walk, we must make the pledge that we shall always march ahead. We cannot turn back.'"










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Absit Omen | 65 comments
I'm crossposting this to the usual suspects... (9.44 / 9)


And I'll probably get FRIED for being a racist myself.

Fuck 'em. I'm dead serious about this.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


Yes, you might get fried. (3.00 / 1)
THe point is that some people will vote on the basis of skin color or race. But too many liberal Democrats see Obama putting a light back on the liberal-socialist agenda, starting with universal medical care, not skin color.

You just went overboard. Back it up a little.



Silence is not an option. It merely helps to perpetuate human rights injustices.


[ Parent ]
gonna go check that one usual suspect (9.00 / 3)
and see if I can't throw my support to you...small as it is.

[ Parent ]
LINKS (0.00 / 0)


MyDD Version

Booman Version

So far.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


a racist? (9.00 / 2)
I'm proud to be a part in electing the first black Prez. I hope millions of people do go out and vote for him because he's black. I don't care if that's the only reason they do it AS LONG AS THEY VOTE FOR HIM. I guess that makes me a racist too.

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


Yeap, it does. (0.00 / 0)
May be if you and MSOC would start listening to the guy, you might get a different rationale for voting for him.



Silence is not an option. It merely helps to perpetuate human rights injustices.


[ Parent ]
We have all the LOGICAL rationale we need. (8.67 / 3)


I'm talking about the OTHER rationale.

We've DEALT with the issues. The issues voters will vote on the issues. The racists will not vote for him if Jesus Christ comes down and COMMANDS it.

I cannot BELIEVE I did not make myself clear, here.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
please.... (9.40 / 5)
I'm not voting for him just because he's black. I have been listening. I just don't care if other people do. some people will vote for Mccain just because Obama is black. it goes both ways. I just want to win. IF EVERY BLACK PERSON IN AMERICA GETS OUT AND VOTES FOR HIM JUST BECAUSE HE'S BLACK TOO-I'm ok with that. If I had been a slave in this country, I would sure as hell get my ass out and  vote for the black man.
I JUST WANT TO WIN!!!
They are going to try and steal another one from us!
I JUST WANT TO FUCKING WIN THIS TIME!

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


[ Parent ]
REPEAT!!! (8.80 / 5)
I JUST WANT TO WIN THIS ONE!!!!

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


Well if I might comment :) (8.75 / 4)
I did intend to keep away longer but as you say,

telling you to ignore it all would be like telling a heroin addict to ignore the baggie of China White on his kitchen counter

Anyway this is interesting because of the comparison between the race thing and the gender thing.  

MSOC says if nothing else vote for Obama because he's black.  Actually I agree 100%.  Although I'd normally say vote Nader or McKinney and yadda yadda yadda I think people will want to vote for Obama just to say they did.  In 40 years time won't you want to say, "Oh yeah I voted for Obama of course"?

So anyone who does vote Obama this year, gets a pass from me (you're welcome).

Obama: vote for him because he's black.
Palin: they must think we're crazy if they think we'll vote for her because she's a woman.

MSOC says many will refuse to vote for Obama because he's black.  He's a true minority.  A representative (more or less) of a genuinely discriminated group.  Palin on the other hand we implicitly recognise is NOT a member of a discriminated group.

Nobody said, "McCain's blown it because many millions of Americans will refuse to vote for a woman -- any woman."

Nobody's discussing how many votes McCain lost that way because nobody thinks there are any.  On the contrary we are discussing how big an advantage , how big a bump McCain gets from going with a woman.  That is, we recognise that being a woman is an electoral advantage and being black or male is an electoral disadvantage in this election.

Incidentally?

Britain first elected a member of a despised minority group to the highest office in the land 140 years ago.  Yeah.  Remember Britain is the place you got your democracy from (not the indians).  It was the real first (large scale) democracy - not the American mythological first.

Women have historically and in modern times often been leaders so it really wouldn't be a big deal if Hillary had won, but I think a president Obama would genuinely be a big deal (especially as Americans would probably pretend they were the first country ever to do it).  Despite feminist pretences that women are a "minority" they have historically enjoyed essentially the same positions and privileges as men of their class.  European countries had their queens as well as kings of course.  Feminist attempts to steal the legitimacy of real minority groups tends to hide just how revolutionary it is to elect a real minority member to the highest office.

So well done America (60% likely anyway; a little premature I guess).

Hmm.  Looks like intrade has Obama moving down to only 51.5% likely to win now.

Someone should tell those racists that if they don't elect Obama now they'll just have to go through this whole thing again and again until they do.  Better to get it out the way surely?

Anyway -- back to trying to NOT comment for a bit :)


Great comment! (0.00 / 0)
I had slightly different reasoning (below, if you're interested), but I think you make some fantastic, and perhaps more persuasive, arguments.

The point about the difference in the media narrative about how Obama being black affects the Obama/Biden ticket, and how Palin being a woman affects the McCain/Palin ticket is particularly striking.

I hope you don't mind if I use it.


[ Parent ]
who are you trying to fool? (0.00 / 0)
you cannot stop yourself from commenting. but really, the racists or semi-racists or people with racial issues might as well go ahead and get it over with. the next guy might be even blacker...not brown like Obama.

just to let you know...I'm trying to be funny...sort of.

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


[ Parent ]
yes I CAN stop myself from..... (7.00 / 3)
Oh DOH :(

[ Parent ]
I just wrote a comment on BooMan... (11.00 / 4)
...to back you up with my own perspective.  It got kinda out of hand, but I didn't say anything I wanted to take out. I want to share my thoughts here too, so I'm cross-posting it with the comment I responded to for context. :)


I have one question no offense intended. You don't have a problem with those who rant to vote for the republican ticket to break the glass ceiling do you. If someone feels that electing a woman to the VP slot is more important to them than electing an AA man to President are they racist or sexist? If they are does that not make you guilty of advocating for the same racism/sexism that you accuse others of? Okay that was more than one question but this identity politics thing is fascinating.

by 2maddogs on Tue Sep 09, 2008 at 05:17:31 PM EST

As MaryScott said, that wasn't quite the point of the diary.  However, I'd like to respond to your point with one of my own:

You almost certainly have heard the Martin Luther King quote "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."  I think that's a pretty good goal, and if you rephrase it to apply to sexism I think it expresses what that fight is about better than anything I've heard.

Ask yourself: Is Obama running on the color of his skin or the content of his character? Is Palin running on the sex of her body or the content of her character?

The answer will tell you who you should support based on the color of his skin or the sex of her body, so as to have an example of someone who has broken through for the right reasons.

I think Obama is the best candidate regardless of the color of his skin. I think Palin's record is questionable and her knowledge, compassion, and experience is insufficient to prepare her for the job.

Obama's race may be part of what makes him so exciting, but if he were white I would still be impressed by his knowledge, his charisma, his vision, and his political acumen. He didn't get nominated just for being black; his nomination was principally based on the content of his character.

If Sara Palin was "Sam Palin", I would still be concerned about many of his past actions. I would still be worried that, having been picked by fiat and so unprepared as to have been barred from being interviewed for several weeks so he could learn what to say, there's no evidence he has what it takes, should it be necessary, to handle the office of President. Perhaps he would rise to the occasion, but the more important the question, the less uncertainty I am willing to tolerate, much less indicators that he would do a bad job. A "Sam Palin" in Sara Palin's position is just not credible. Which leaves me feeling that Sara Palin was chosen principally for the sex of her body.

If you agree, even in the broadest way, with my characterization of why these two candidates were chosen, I think you will understand why I strongly support Obama for the color of his skin and I do not give Sara Palin much extra credit for the sex of her body. If Barak were "Barry", I would strongly support him for all but one of the same reasons I do so now; if Sara were "Sam" I would wonder what in the cosmos the McCain camp was thinking.

If you still aren't convinced, think about how what the talking heads say would be different for each candidate if they were both white men. Don't worry about how they got here for the moment, just assume they are and think about what those talking heads would have been saying over the last couple weeks.

And that, in a very large nutshell, is why I think MaryScott's essay hit the nail on the head.


You mean MyDD. (0.00 / 0)


Nobody comments on my posts at Booman anymore.

I think there's some sort of Orange Cloud over me there.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
You're right (0.00 / 0)
I meant MyDD.  I go to those two so rarely that, with their similar layouts, I can hardly tell the difference.


[ Parent ]
Orange cloud? (4.00 / 1)
No. I don't think so. Take a look at the rest of the diaries on that site. Other than the front page stuff, how much discussion do you see? That site has just really emptied out. It's a shame. Booman's a good writer. Steven D is great. It was the personality stuff and all the bannings. There's very little "community" on that community blog anymore.

"What fresh hell is this?" -- Dorothy Parker

[ Parent ]
Dispirted liberal purists.... (11.00 / 1)
...are not the problem.  It probably was with Kerry, but less so with Obama, something I was never really ever able to fully reconcile with the rhetoric on blogs against centrism.

Obama has an Ohio, Missouri, Kerry/Gore/Dukakis General Election problem.  The same voters that scared the ever loving crap out of us.  Where do you suppose they went?

I'm not trying to change the subject on you.  I get the whole last resort argument for those of the stubborn purity variety, or the clear eyed realists, but again, that's not why I agree with the gloomy prognosticators such as eugene, more today than yesterday.

I was all steady as she goes in 2004 through all the SYFPH and now what's been coined "concern trolling", wishing the people like JamesB3 (remember him?) who told us again and again in so many words, this is a culture war and we're going to lose, were just inclined to pessimism, terminally no hopers.

We'll never get over the heartsick feeling of election day 2000 and 2004.  How could it be?  And it was and it is. The only way you don't lose a culture war is you make the election about something else.

But you made it about appeal to advancing a race.  I know where your heart is and I agree that this country's history makes an argument like that seem justifiable.  It would probably be enough for me if I were otherwise obstinately opposed, but I've got other reasons for voting Obama.  I'm an Obama critic but I'm not the problem.  

Heartsick liberals, progressives, whatever they call themselves, are not the problem.  Conservative Democrats, now that's another story...

And can I just say anecdotal evidence in places like California are not convincing?

“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live”--Oscar Wilde


I must REALLY suck at this. (6.00 / 1)


My point:

REGISTER VOTERS.

Period.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
My point: (0.00 / 0)
Ground game is not enough.

I don't think you mean I should go knock on doors and say, "Excuse me John and Jane Public, think maybe you might vote for this man because he's black, c'mon that's a good reason, right?"

I thought it was a rallying cry to stubborn liberals who persistently spread their negative manure around, a reason to get off their ass and work for Obama.  

We don't have an enthusiasm, or do or die motivation gap.  

It's not a good argument for new voters.

“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live”--Oscar Wilde


[ Parent ]
NO! NO! NO! NO NO NO NO (3.00 / 1)


I'm not saying that AT ALL.

I'm saying we should go door to door and REGISTER VOTERS.

PERIOD.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
I hope that's enough. (4.00 / 1)
And I'm not trying to an ass, but I can't get past the argument you put forth about race.  I honestly thought you offered it as a motivation for people who would otherwise go Obama, except for the tweedle dum tweedle dee, nothing matters, it's all the same, they're all crappy losers, Kucinch! folks.

Seriously.

Forgive my sarcasm, it's not meant meanly toward you personally.

I shouldn't have stepped on your laudable call to register more voters.

“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live”--Oscar Wilde


[ Parent ]
See, here's the thing... (9.00 / 2)


There are people out there to whom the USUAL appeals don't mean dick.

I'm trying to think outside the box.

Now, maybe I'm one of those people Bill Maher thinks BELONGS in the box -- "THe box is for YOU! YOU... STAY IN THE BOX!!!"

But I was sitting in the shower last night, praying to a god in whom I don't believe... "What can I do? What can I say? I'm all outta rant. The ones who will be swayed by logic will not be looking to ME for those arguments..."

This is what I came up with.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
if you were praying.... (7.75 / 4)
then it was to SOMETHING that you believe in. don't put GOD in a conservative box. my GOD is not the GOD of sarah palin. my GOD is a liberal. remember the 12 steps?
a HIGHER POWER. period.

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


[ Parent ]
Well, if nothing else (7.00 / 2)
we appreciate the shower scene.

Unless it was like Hitchcock's...then...not so much.

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
Why not? (9.00 / 2)
Think of it this way:

It's 2048 and you've got your grand kids or great grand kids with you and on TV there's a program about the first ever black US president.  Now in 2048 this guy is as famous as Martin Luther King and JFK combined are today.  So it's on TV and your great grandkids ask like, "Were you alive back then granny?"

What are you going to want to say?

Of course you'll want to say you voted for him.  Or as Shakespeare put it,

And gentlemen in England now abed, Shall think themselves
accursed they were not here

It's history in the making isn't it?


[ Parent ]
WOW (9.00 / 1)
now today you are on the Obama bandwagon. good. maybe my grandson will be the 3rd or 4th black Prez. or maybe he will be a rock star and make his Nana happy.
rock star/President of the USA...it's all good.

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


[ Parent ]
So... maybe I made a difference... (6.00 / 1)


With one person?

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.

[ Parent ]
One person who doesn't have a vote? (7.00 / 1)
I guess I take a long term view.  I don't see any reason to vote for Obama except the reason that you highlight in this diary.  It's not a political reason but it would be a selfish reason -- from my perspective.  However, you know, it's long term and the problems of your country won't be solved in a single election (in fact by any election at all).  So I guess it would be OK to indulge myself on this one occasion -- if I had a vote.

Still I won't be changing my tune here and elsewhere.  "Vote Obama -- it's the cool thing to do -- you know you want to really" is not an argument I'd like to make.

At best you could (and some have) make the argument that Obama's hype, and the whole first black president thing might be enough to enthuse people towards more real results longer term.  However as eugene says in his diary, that may or may not be true.


[ Parent ]
Of course. (0.00 / 0)
It is history making.

And others have made that argument, but it seemed again to be directed at people otherwise inclined to go Obama.  Maybe there is a possibility to overwhelm the culture voters with new voters who want to make history.  But wow, I thought that was already crystal clear.  Haven't people noticed their chance to make that history?



“Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live”--Oscar Wilde


[ Parent ]
Thanks maryscott (10.00 / 3)
for validating my feelings these last few months.

Make no mistake, I think Barack is a great candidate and I agree with his views on most issues.

But all things being equal, if there were three candidates of equal intelligence, poise and ability to inspire, one being white male, one being white female, one a black man...I would support the black man to in some small way pay back what black men have done for this country.

What would America be without the toil of slaves, without Carver and Douglas, Baldwin, Joplin, Satchmo, and Bird, without Duke Ellington and Thurgood Marshall, without Little Richard and Poitier, Chuck Berry, Jesse Owens, Ray Charles, Stevie Wonder, Richard Pryor...

A piss poor place to live.  





"Fascism is attracting the dregs of humanity- people with a slovenly biography - sadists, mental freaks, traitors." - ILYA EHRENBURG


The peanut butter vote!!! (7.33 / 3)
Works for me.
And wtf was up with Rachael Maddow last night saying chocolate and peanut butter don't go together?
Is she a s'mores person?

If at first you don't suceed, go get stoned.

[ Parent ]
I have to have a break. (0.00 / 0)
I worked one hour and have been on this blog all day. when I wasn't here I was over at KID ROCK stirring up shit with the jerry Springer crowd over there. don't get me wrong...I've met some nice folks too. but some of them are right off Jerry's show and I'm not in the mood to ignore ignorance today. my husband just got home. later!!!!!

Sadie Yates
RIP
2003-2008


MaryScott, you know I love you... (1.00 / 1)
... but you are so wrong on this it's almost breathtaking.

Make no mistake: The single determinative factor in this election is the colour of Barack Obama's skin.

Ah, no.  The single determinative factor is money, and even that is not so cut-and-dried.  It's not as easy as pointing at the candidate with the biggest warchest, or the candidate with the most big-money supporters... the candidate that will win this election is the candidate that will best serve the interests of the corporatocracy.

ALL of the "identity politics" hoohah is the distraction that keeps up glued to the boob tube and reading the newspapers, which makes the MSM happy 'cause they can keep raking in the ad dollars.

For some reason, in light of mucho evidence to the contrary, you seem to still believe that we hold fair elections in this country of ours.  Why do you insist on holding this quaint belief?  Do you still believe in Santy Claws, too? ;)

[It doesn't help that you lifted an article from BET, an extremely poor source of ANY type of information in my opinion. When did that shithole become credible about anything other than rap videos?]

Armed with this "knowledge" about unregistered black voters, your "solution" is to engage more people in this counterfeit election process in the hope that the ruling powers will actually count the votes and report a result NOT in their favor?  

Is that the "Hope" I keep hearing about?  "I hope they don't steal this one..."

Maybe the fact that you're a self-confessed "political junkie" has something to do with your stubborn naivete.  Your heart really wants to believe in the fairytales, even as your considerable intellect struggles with denying the reality that's been kicking our asses everyday for more than a decade:  the horse left the barn so long ago, we forgot what it looked like.  

You want this country back?  You're gonna have to do a lot more than registering voters to pick the lesser of two assholes.


GODDAMNIT, PAUL. (9.00 / 1)


You know I dig you, man, but...

What the fuck is YOUR solution, anyway?

GODDAMNIT. I am so fucking sick of being told what I already know: YES, the system is broken. YES, they feed from the same trough. YES, YES, YES. The Democrats are 99.999% as bad as the Republicans.

WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO ABOUT IT RIGHT FUCKING NOW?

If it matters for NO OTHER REASON than a SYMBOLIC ONE, this goddamned election MATTERS.

DOn't tell me it doesn't, because you're full of SHIT if you say it doesn't. ASK JESSE JACKSON IF IT MATTERS. ASK MALCOLM X.

Ask  the SCOTTSBORO NINE.

GODDAMNIT.

Are you seriously going to SIT AT HOME AND NOT VOTE?

Christ, I could fucking weep all goddamned night. And yeah, it's all the more agonising coming from you.



--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
Listen, I realize you're upset... (5.50 / 2)
... but I'm not gonna sugar-coat it for you: this "election" means a lot less, in the grand scheme of things, than you and a shitload of people think it does.

No matter which of those two dissembling jerks gets elected, the bogus War on Drugs will continue unabated.

No matter which of those two proven liars wins, the War on "Terror" will continue to enrichen the military industrial complex.

And even if Obama wins the opportunity to move into it, it will still be the "White" House, with all the hidden meanings and codes the term has ever held.  Imagine if he had the cajones to suggest perhaps the name is outdated, insulting to non-whites and needs to be changed; you know what the reaction would be.

You really want to know what you should do right fucking now?  I got two answers for you, so get yer pen and pad, here they are:  

1) Run for office yourself, under any party but the deadly duo.  Put yourself and your friends in a legislature somewhere and start changing laws for the better.  THAT'S some action for your ass.  You gotta lot of angry energy right now, so get a petition drive going and get your ass in office somewhere.  Don't VOTE for change... BE the change.

Of course, that's for those of you who believe, against all obvious evidence, that independent candidates will get fair elections.  If you believe in the power of the vote, then you have to believe in the viability of third-party candidacies, right?  Wrong, some of you believe the elections are NOT fixed, but also think committed third-party candidates like McKinney and Nader are more problematical than useful.  Face it, you're hooked on the old.

For the rest, there's option 2) RESISTANCE.  Of which little more will be said about that topic on a public website, especially now that "our party" has allowed us to be surveilled without penalty.

What?  That too much work?  


[ Parent ]
I don't believe there is such a thing as fairness in the system as it exists today. (3.00 / 1)


And worse, I see no way for that system to change when the people in power hold the controls to changing that system.

Vicious circle.

But when you say shit like this:

"... this "election" means a lot less, in the grand scheme of things, than you and a shitload of people think it does."

All I can think about is the year 2000.

And over 4000 dead Americans and hundreds of thousands of dead Iraqis. And hundreds of thousands more maimed and lives destroyed.

MEANS A LOT LESS???

The FUCK, you say.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
Gore would have invaded Iraq (2.00 / 3)
He and Clinton had been bombing it for years and been pushing for a larger war for a while.  They killed about as many Iraqis as Bush.

And Gore wouldn't have done anything for Global Warming.  He didn't when in power.

Funny.  Democrat politicians seem to get better as people AFTER they lose an election.

The reasons the next 4 years will be less important than the last 8 is because you're already tapped out as a nation.  Bush already stole the money, already broke the military.  They may want to rip you off and start WW3 but it just isn't there.

No, the elites know they need a time of rebuilding the economy and rebuilding confidence in the system.  Obama is a better choice for that but I'm sure nobody in real power cares all that much either way.


[ Parent ]
DB, you can (8.00 / 3)
hold your balls breath until you're blue in the face, and not prove your point.

Gore didn't invade Iraq.

Bush did.

And no matter how much you wish, you can't lay that one on anyone else.

Deal with it.  

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
You'd be better off saying (2.33 / 3)
"Gore didn't kill a million Iraqis, Clinton did."  Technically they did attack Iraq for many years though through bombing and genocidal sanctions not an invasion.  They did that.  Not Bush.  Both Bushes did their own shit.  

The evidence runs against those who would paint Gore as very much different from Bush.

Why is this so hard to admit?


[ Parent ]
Ummmmm (6.00 / 2)
because unless you've given the Vice President a lot more authority in the constitutional chain of command, Gore didn't do shit!!!!

I know that Cheney has had his hand up Bush's ass for the last 8 years....but that would be extra-constitutional.

I'm good with you painting the Bill Clinton with that brush.  I've always said that the original UN and Congressional authorization (Bush I)was more than enough justification for Bush II to invade Iraq, at least given Clinton's continuing agression during his 8 years.

But I just can't see painting Gore with that brush when he was presiding over the Senate.

Unless you think he was in charge all along, and the Clintons were here his sockpuppets.

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
It pointless continuing to talk to you about ethics (3.00 / 1)
when you think genocide and ethnic cleansing are funny.

I will point out that you're lying about the UN resolution and congressional bill.


[ Parent ]
What (7.50 / 2)
you don't think that Bush I had the appropriate authorization?

Or that during the conflict, Saddam declared war on the United States.

Or that we concluded or initial action with a cease fire and a truce, NOT a peace treaty?

That Clinton was operating extra-constitutionally by attacking Iraqis with cruise missiles and aerial attacks, and the Republicans didn't impeach him for THAT?

Or were those authorizations rescinded?

Did the congress, either Republican or Democrat Controlled, even bother to implement the War Powers Act?

Or is it just that you can't find a way to blame Al Gore for the actions of a President for which he was Vice President.

Shall we give Spiro Agnew credit for opening up China?

How about LBJ being the hero of the Cuban Missile Crisis.

No matter, your diatribe failed because you have proven your ignorance above.

I, like many here, including Paul and Karmafish, hold the Israeli Government specifically responsible for the deaths and hardships of the Palestinian People.  The problem I have with Shergald and others, is that I don't hold them, AIPAC, and the U.S. Government, SOLELY responsible.  Some of the fault is owned by the Arab nations and some by the Palestinians themselves.

No matter, see my comment above.  

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
don't ever talk to me again you holocaust denying piece of shit (0.00 / 2)
are we clear?

[ Parent ]
Yes, the American military has shocked (0.00 / 0)
and awed quite a bit after "9/11", haven't they? But you don't think the attack would have happened if the election wasn't stolen in 2000?  

Is that why 2000 is the only year you can think about?  

Well, to your point, THIS election means less than that one.  Permawar is already underway with the construction of the Iraqi embassy and the increasing military infrastructure in Africa.  Barack/Biden have no intent on stemming that tide, so expect more hundreds of thousands of "others" being killed and dispossessed over the next four years.  

By the way, why did you make a distinction between American and Iraqi dead? Media-hypnotic reflex?  The fuck you say?  You know there is no difference, right?


[ Parent ]
Makes a difference (0.00 / 0)
to which side of the gun they are on.

US soldiers are thugs for hire and obviously should not be conflated with figures on the innocent Iraqi victims of their bloodbath.

In fact to the extent it matters the more US dead the better surely?  There seems no other way for them to find a measure of justice for their crimes and too the higher the US death toll the more resistance to the war in the US.


[ Parent ]
Upon further reflection upon your intonation of symbolism and dead people (0.00 / 0)
WAKE UP!

That is, I refer you to Rage in the Machine and a few selected lines from their song by that name:


Movements come and movements go
Leaders speak, movements cease
When their heads are flown...

Networks at work, keepin' people calm
you know they went after King
when he spoke out on Vietnam
He turned the power to the have-nots
and then came the shot...

Yea, the several federal men
Who pulled schemes on the dream
and put it to an end

With his avowed militarism, Obama is clearly not Martin Luther King, Jr., so this shouldn't be a problem for him.

Zach rages on:


Ya better beware
of retribution with mind war
20/20 visions and murals with metaphors

The networks at work, keepin, people calm
Ya know they murdered X
and tried to blame it on Islam
He turned the power to the have-nots
And then came the shot

What was the price on his head

First, let me say it pains me to even discuss Barack Obama in the midst of these Giants, in this context. I'm willing to give the man a chance to prove himself, but as it stands now, his values are nothing like King and X. Those gentlemen were unjustly killed for standing for human rights for all.  Some people seem to have a problem with the word "all."



[ Parent ]
Paul, I don't necessarily believe (9.67 / 3)
that it is all about the money.  It is close to my own cynical opinion, but I do think that many elections in this country are honest.  The politicians, not so much.

In one way you are right, the horse you speak of left the barn a long time ago.  Like a CENTURY.  But I will quote one of my favorite authors on the subject.

I doesn't matter if the game is rigged.  If you don't gamble, you can't win

R. A. Heinlein

All that surrendering to the inevitable gets you is an easy rationalization when things go bad.

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
THANK you. (6.00 / 1)


--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.

[ Parent ]
Thanks, I certainly respect Heinlein (5.00 / 1)
and I defer to your timeline on the corruption, though if you go too far back, you negate some of the very important contributions that modern media tech has made to the national hypnosis.

But you seem to be giving these folks some kind of brownie points for running a "mostly honest" democracy, even admitting that the politicians are basically all crooks.  I admit, I find a sad humor in it at times as well... like every time I watch Jon Stewart.  Shit.

However, this thread isn't really about many elections, just one, right?  

Re: Heinlein's quote... why would you agree to play a rigged game?  Why would you even play a known game rigger?  I know!  Let's have a convention in Vegas!


[ Parent ]
Well, unless you redefine the rules (9.00 / 1)
it is the only game in town.  You did mention another one, though, in your previous comment.

And I recall (not personally, I'm not that old) the Hearst Newspapers starting a War with Spain, in 1898.  Just after W. R. Hearst boasted he could.

I'd date it from then.

1898...110 years.


DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
MSOC, I agree and disagree (0.00 / 0)
and if that isn't the biggest cop out on this board, I'm sure I'll come up with another one, later.

But.. I do believe that we should GOTV.  I do believe that Obama would be better than McCain.  I even believe that issues aside, we should vote for Senator Obama for the same reasons I think you do, that it would be a significant step towards that utopian melting pot that many wish this nation could be.

But issues do mean something, and although I often agree with fiscally conservative Republicans for no other reason that the smaller the government the less unnecessary intrusion in our lives, my "moral" issues are generally on the liberal side.  But that is my vote.

Here's another one....

On the subject of the essay itself....

I related a story a week or so ago about a Southern Californian I know.  An African-American male.  Who lives in South L.A., Maxine Waters district.  He ran against her one year, not in the primary, but as a Republican.

So many of us cannot see the frame of mind of the "true believers."  This is a good guy.  A hard working City employee for over 25 years.  Mortgage, 4 kids, a wife who is going back to work after surviving breast cancer.  He doesn't beat his wife, he isn't illiterate.  He has more teeth than I do.  He's got a daughter who is marrying someone she met while in university..in England.

And although so many of the current crop of Republicans have disappointed him, he will still vote McCain/Palin.  Although he acknowledges many salient points to me in our political discussions, he still feels that the methods that Democratic Party has tried to use to solve inner-city problems are anathema to his belief system.

He has a deep, sincere religous background and he does not believe in abortion.  Neither does his wife.

I for one, don't consider them "race traitors."  I believe that they believe differently than I do, and I'm OK with that.  They don't buy into the rhetoric, because so much of it comes from a distrusted source...white people.  But they are sincere in their beliefs.

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


So is my mother. (0.00 / 0)


But she has finally -- FINALLY -- weighed the costs and benefits of voting for Republicans versus Democrats and figured out the truth: ABORTIONS GO DOWN UNDER DEMOCRATS.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.

[ Parent ]
This is true... (2.00 / 1)
but, as I mentioned, it is also the methods that "traditional" Democrats have used during his lifetime with which he disagrees.

He does believe in the whole "bootstraps" concept, which may certainly be fanciful, but it is his belief.  He saw so much death and distrust growing up in South Central, and it appeared to him that the Democrats were actively working to keep his people down while saying they weren't.

I guess the hypocrisy of that situation bothers him less than the naked racism so prevalent in parts of the GOP.  This is the guy who acknowledged that he felt like a pepper flake in the salt shaker at the California GOP convention.  He may have been their token, but many of his beliefs matched theirs.

This is a guy who voted for Deukmejian, over Tom Bradley, for Governor.  He is certain that the "Bradley EFfect" wasn't just people lying to pollsters, but pollsters taking for granted that every black person would vote for Bradley.  If so, it appears to be a large mistake, as may be your conclusion about registering black voters.

In many ways, it is like the anti-Kerry veterans that appeared to surprise the Democrats in the last election.

I know, or knew..a few have passed on, about 20 Vietnam Veterans at work during the 2000-2004 period.  Of those 20, 1 was pro-Kerry.  It wasn't just swiftboating.  There was a mistaken assumption that anybody who fought in Vietnam would respect his service and his political beliefs.  The children of these men have all learned that Vietnam was a "bad" war.  And unfortunately, many of the returning veterans have been placed in either "Born of the Fourth of July" or "Rambo" boxes, when the majority are neither.  And mind you, this isn't in the Rural South or Mid-West.  This is in Blue Southern California.  It was a while ago, but I can't remember that many big, vocal veteran groups for Bill Clinton, either.

So many of the assumptions of the Democratic party are mistaken, it isn't surprising that they continually get beat in elections, or they end up being close enough to be stolen.  This is why I think that the Palin choice was arguably genius.  It pandered to the base, the Republicans made sure that their Religous Right voters will be out there supporting the ticket.

Just who did the selection of Biden appeal to other than the old way of doing things, the same mistaken assumptions, the need for insiders in DC?

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
It appealed to me. (4.00 / 1)

But then, I believe in Biden more than most.

And I wrote the fucking Bankruptcy Bill post.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
Ah, but by your own admission (0.00 / 0)
you're not a typical Democratic voter, especially the last couple of years.

I think, unless Obama had named some whacko like Leiberman, you would have voted for him anyway, in fact, I'm pretty sure you'd publicly resigned to that fact before the convention.

What large voter group of the Democratic party does Biden appeal to?  White males?  Not in the south or midwest.  Hell, if he'd have chosen Hilary, this election was over, no matter the ammo the GOP had.  It would have defused the Palin pick pre-emptively, it would pander to the disaffected groups of the Democratic Party, and it would have solved a lot of the "readiness" issues about Obama's administration.

Hindsight is 20/20.  But Hilary as the VP would have probably meant Romney as the GOP choice, and it would have been over.

Like it or not, unless they find more than the sadly usual corruption on Palin, the Democratic Party was pwned on this one.

Oh look....Newspeak.....I'm an internet geek.

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
I have an argument for you: (6.33 / 3)


He didn't pick Hillary.

Knowing what we know, knowing what you just said, which is fairly obvious.

He didn't pander.

He picked the one HE wanted.

Just CONSIDER, for a moment, the possibility that BARACK OBAMA PICKED VP HE WANTED.

Not the one guaranteed to win him the election.

Just something about which to think when tempted to dismiss the Biden pick as "pandering." Because, honestly -- I cannot see the PANDER in that pick.

--7.88, --6.56      If I can't rant, I don't want to be part of your revolution.


[ Parent ]
I guess I'm more cynical than you!!! (6.00 / 1)
I think it wasn't pandering.

It was The Deal.

Full backing by the Washington Elite, the Insiders, who Obama had been hammering for the entire primary cycle.

I think it was the deal to freeze out the Clintons, who had been a thorn in the side for a looooong time.

It was selling out to old money.

Just my opinion, though.  You could be right.  He could have chosen the guy he wanted, and to hell with the election, or at least because he thought he could win it with a combination of issues, his change message and the mistaken assumptions of decades of Democratic Party thinking.

If so, then I think he may be just what others paint him to be.

Far too naive.

DA is The Most Interesting Man in the World. - Karmafish


[ Parent ]
I'm not buying it (5.33 / 3)
Show me a Republican and I'll show you a selfish asshole.  That's what "family values" means.  That and racism and gay bashing of course.

Greed and hate.

Small town values.


[ Parent ]
I see your point, DavidByron3, and you're right. but (0.00 / 0)
This:

"Show me a Republican and I'll show you a selfish asshole.  That's what "family values" means.  That and racism and gay bashing of course.
Greed and hate.

Small town values."

has also been pretty much the case with most of the Democrats lately, as well, with few, if any modifications.

Ahhhh....Life goes on.


[ Parent ]
True enough though there are degrees of it (1.00 / 2)
Apparently at least four people even on this board are such hate filled cripples that they think on-going ethnic cleansing and genocide are fit subject for jokes.

I just don't understand people filled with that much hate and violence -- especially when they pretend to be liberal or something.


[ Parent ]
Well, (8.00 / 2)
I agree with the title of your post, and  I certainly agree with this:

"I just don't understand people filled with that much hate and violence -- especially when they pretend to be liberal or something"

However, I strenously disagree with this:

"Apparently at least four people even on this board are such hate filled cripples that they think on-going ethnic cleansing and genocide are fit subject for jokes."

Here's why:  While it's true that Israel's policies of occupying the West Bank, with its settlement policiesm, the extremely harsh treatment of Palestinian civilians, humiliating checkpoints, housing demolitions, etc.,  there's something else that one has to look at, also:

A)  The four people that you accuse of hatred are just as critical of Israel's policies towards the Palestinians and advocate a 2-state solution to the whole conflict, and agree, as I do, that Israel must pull her troops and settlements out of West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem and allow  the Palestinians to create their own independent, sovereign nation-state in the above-mentioned territories alongside Israel, and not in place of it, like lots of people want.

B)  It's also true, however, that, as harsh as Israel's treatment of the Palestinians is, the Arab world, including the Palestinians aren't without blame either.  T he Arab countries, as well as the many Palestinians themselves, have also contributed, in no small ways over the years, to the fact that the Palestinians are without an independent, sovereign nation-state of their own.    For the first 40 years of Israel's existence, the Arab world exploited the Palestinians as a politican football as a means of making war on Israel, and the Palestinians also engaged in many terrorist activities against Israel both before and after 1967, when West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem and Golan Heights were captured by Israel in the six-day war.  These activities included:  Use of W. Bank, and Gaza Strip as launching pads for cross-border attacks on Israel, prior to 1967.  Syrians used to
shoot down on Israeli farms and kibbutzes from Golan Heights prior to 1967.  In the late 1960's to mid 1970's, there were a number of PLO-sponsored hijackings and hostage taking of Israeli El-Al Airlliners, the massacre of Israeli Athletes at t he 1972 Munich Olympics, not to mention the attempt of a similar hijacking/hostage taking act at  Entebbe, Uganda, in  1976,   which was successfully foiled by Israeli commandoes.  The more recent suicide bombing attacks by Palestinians on innocent Israeli civilians, too, has been an albotross.  So, again, all of the above having been said, one can  criticize and condemn Israel's policies in West Bank, Gaza Strip and East Jerusalem and still realize that the Arab world, including many of the Palestinians and their leaders, aren't blameless, either.

Ahhhh....Life goes on.


[ Parent ]
OK I was wrong (3.50 / 2)
five people.
sorry for not counting you but I didn't see your endorsement of the "joke" until later.

As above please don't ever respond to me again you piece of shit.


[ Parent ]
LMAO!! (0.00 / 0)
Don't worry,, DavidByron3, you asshole!  I won't respond to you any more.  You've got my word.

Ahhhh....Life goes on.

[ Parent ]
JUSTICE! (0.00 / 0)
In "It's the Issues, Stupid
The Obama Poll Drop"
, MICHAEL COLBY observes,
Because the polling news hasn't been good. While the lib-Dems have been blogging and pontificating themselves into a stupor over all the stupid stuff about Palin, the American people have been moving away from Obama and toward - say what? - the McCain/Palin ticket. And the movement has been significant enough for the likes of Kos, AmericaBlog and Talking Points Memo - three leading liberal blogs - to use words like "panic," "worried" and "overestimated" while describing the current state of affairs. . . .

And that's what the lib-Dems don't get: When you talk the talk of change, you've also got to walk the walk. Otherwise, you look like John Kerry or Al Gore. You know, two guys who took the voting public for fools by refusing to stand firm on their issues, changed issue-horses in mid-stream and, as a result, were both L.O.S.E.R.S.


http://www.counterpunch.org/
Having made similar points several weeks ago, but less adequately, on one of the named "liberal blog" sites, and had calls for being banned forever from the site, being a McCain "ringer," and a general degenerate, excuse me for humbly (and sadly because I am terrified by the McCain "bounce") pronouncing: JUSTICE!  Or, should I say, L.O.S.E.R.S.!

Absit Omen | 65 comments


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